Woods

A few weeks ago Luke Ueda- Sarson visited and we did a fair bit of gaming. Lukes reports can be found here. Sufficed to say we nearly ran out of bags for my ass.

The first part of the visit was the ceremonial making of the terrain. Using all the standard starting materials we quickly assembled some hills, rivers, roads and hedges. The tatty felt industry received a boost that day.
One thing that I've never really been satisfied with is models of woods.Well, that and town sectors, but I have a few ideas on that.

Our hunt for a better forest starts with the ones I made 10 years ago out of left over carpet from a friends flat. These hexes still serve the SH/MSH group in Wellington.

I was not overly happy with these as they didn't quite work visually on the table,and didn't grip stands particularly well either. However, as we all know, its a fine/invisible line between visual appeal and playability, and I really wanted both.

As an example, here is what I was looking for.

Now, I've put a bit (OK, sod all) thought into this over the years, and it was at last time to act.
I purchased a rubber backed coil door mat, a can of dark green spray paint and a ground foam 'block'. The ground foam block was broken up into small chunks. The doormat was cut up into a variety of shapes, and the top spray painted. They were then covered with PVA and pressed into a plastic tray of the ground foam.

We both felt that the end result worked really well visually and succeeded practically as well

In between

Last week I scored from Trademe (the local E-bay) a copy of 'Modern Army lists and organisations for the 1950's and 60's' by Bruce Rea-Taylor.

I've always been intrigued by this period, with an interesting collection of cast off WW2 and more modern equipment. The lists are (in the large part) for 1958 and 1968. The 1958 lists tend to have a collection of left over WW2 equipment and 1st generation post war equipment. the 1968 lists are reasonably similar to the late 70's in terms of equipment.

What I did find interesting was that some of the NATO armies were a bit more interesting than there 1980's equivalent. The West Germans get Japanzer Kannone battalions, while the French get interesting mixtures of APC's and AMX13's. Everyone else seems to use Centurions The British must have made millions of the damn things.

I'll have to sit down in the next couple of weeks and create some army lists based on the information contained. One question to be determined will be the Command ratings. Should they be comparative with armies from the same time period (ie remarkably similar to today's ratings) or should they be scaled with the technology involved ie NATO 2 vs WARPAC 2 or even 3rd world for the lesser armies.

Russian list attempt 2

After my previous list was invalidated by some changes to the scenario system, I decided to have another go. This is teh first list that I have written in a long time.
I moved the time back 5 years to 1980. out went all the corps artillery, and I went back to the divisional and regimental level stuff. Unfortunately this means that you are reduced to throwing stones at the defenders with 122 mm howitzers, but its better than nothing, and can at least be used for a couple of rounds of smoke.
(I find it a bit odd that if a WW2 battalion had 6 120mm artillery pieces attached to it that would be a stack of artillery. In MSH I feel that it just entertains the defenders).

The point of difference with this list is the core is 2 beefed up BTR 70 battalions with attached tank companies. The 3rd battalion is the divisional independent tank battalion.

RHQ
1 BTR 70			@7		7
2 battalions each
BHQ	1 BTR-70		@7		7
	9 BTR-70 ICT		@7		63
	1 BTR-70 AT		@19		19
	1 BTR-70 AA		@14		14
	2 120mm Mortar/truck		@7		14
	3 T64B		@26		78
					195
				2	390
AA coy	1 ZSU 23/4		@17		17
	1 SA-9		@21		21
AT coy	2 BRDM-3		@19		38
artillery	1 FAO (on table)		@10		10
off table	4 D30 122 How		@9 x 0.8		29
					39
Divisional attachments
Independent tank battalion
BHQ	T62E		@21		21
	10 T62E		@21		210
					231
AT coy	2 BRDM-3		@19		38
helicopters
	2 Hind D		@43		86
artillery	1 FAO (on table)		@10		10
off table	4 D30 122 How		@9 x 0.8		29
					39
artillery	1 FAO (on table)		@10		10
off table	4 D20 152 How		@11 x 0.8		35
					45
					944
				944 *0.9	849.6
Option A
Counter battery.
off table	4 M46 122 gun		@13 x 0.8		42

Not sure what I would add for options. Possibly a small BTR battalion to operate with the tank battalion to provide some infantry support as either an option A, or a larger battalion as an option B. More AA in the form of an off table SA-6 would not go amiss either.

Russan MRR c 1985

Its been a fair while since we posted anything here.

A question about SovietWarpac forces on the Spearhead Yahoogroup in the last couple of weeks prompted me to have a dig in the files for some of my Russian lists.I have not written any lists for this army for a long time, so will have to rely on memory for my reasoning. This list was written for the NZ Nationals in 2008, so some will say its been optimised for competition. I recall that I never really optimised lists, I just came up with things that I thought would either work well on the table, or just be interesting to play. If that is 'optimised', I'll eat my hair...

The list is based on a BTR motor rifle regiment. I used BTR 70's as those were the models I had brought back in 1990

Russian MRR attack list c. 1985 RHQ 1 BTR 70  @7 7 2 battalions each BHQ 1 BTR-70  @7 7 9 BTR-70 ICT  @7 63 1 BTR-70 AT  @19 19 1 BTR-70 AA  @14 14 2 120mm Mortar/truck  @7 14 117 x2 = 234 1 battalion BHQ 1 BTR-70  @7 7 9 BTR-70 ICT  @7 63 1 BTR-70 AT  @19 19 1 120mm Mortar/truck  @7 7 96 1 1attalion BHQ T64BV  @28 28 9 T64BV  @28 252 280 AA coy 1 ZSU 23/4  @17 17 1 SA-9  @21 21 AT coy 2 BRDM-3  @19 38 Divisional attachments AA coy  1 SA-6 off table  @32 x 0.8  25 AT coy 2 BRDM-3  @19 38 helicopters 2 Hind E   @45 90 Combined arms army support 2 Battalions off table artillery 1 FAO (on table)  @10 10 3 BM-27 MRL +1 ICM mission @26x0.8 62 72 x 2 =144 army total 990 x0.9=900 option A artillery 1 FAO (on table)  @10 10 off table 4 D20 152 How  @11 x 0.8 35 10 entrenchments  @1 55 x 0.9 =50 Option A 1 AGC  @10 10 1 SU 25 frogfoot  @41 41 51 x 0.9 =46 Option B 1 AGC  @10 10 2 SU 25 frogfoot/rockets@41 82 92 x 0.9 =92 option B 2 artillery battalions off table 1 FAO (on table)  @10 10 4 D20 152 How  @11 x 0.8 35 x 2 = 90 x0.9=50

Notes.

I have not used the MRR SU-122 artillery battalions as they are not that much use unless on table in the direct fire mode or spotting for themselves. I instead picked BM-27 fire support as there is nothing that will ruin any ones day quite like an MRL strike (I'm not sure how I was allowed to use these but the list was checked and allowed as legal, so I can blame others)

In the first option A, I included 10 entrenchments. Not something that an attacking army would normally choose. I was considering using them for the scenario attack stance where you can start 1 battalion on table. I would possibly dig them in to hold a flank while the rest of the army attacks with a secure flank to counter a NATO flank march. They also use up 10 points that I would otherwise leave hanging.

A list allows 3 option A's and 3 option B's. I would suggest creating your own instead of using mine.

If you are not happy with the MRL's, I would swap these for an SU-122 battalion, 152mm howitzers or support from the divisional tank battalion.

The other side of the fence.

Following on from the Austrians, I figured it was as good a time as any to cover the opposition.
Luke Ueda-Sarson has exhaustively covered the Czechs, and I'm going to wave my hands a bit describing the Hungarians. All information for this list has been sourced from Bruce Rea-Taylor's "Ultramodern army lists vol1" and Google tends to broadly back it up.
The Hungarians managed to have there own arms industry as well, though not on the same scale as the Czechs or Poles. It was pretty much just their own wheeled APC. Unlike everyone else it was based on a 4 wheeled chassis (not 8 like everyone else). This suggests that the average Hungarian is a bit smaller than his fellow Warpac allies. It also means that the support weapons get their own separate ride.

The Hungarian army was mostly motor rifle divisions with only one tank division (from my notes). Their tank of choice was the good old T55A.

Regimental HQ
1 OT-65/ command stand
1 PSZH-4 Infantry combat team

3 Battalions
BHQ 1 PSZH-4 command team
6 PSZH-4 Infantry combat teams
1 PSZH-4 / 30mm GL team
1 PSZH-4 / Sagger ATGW team
1 PSZH-1 / SA-7 team
1 PSZH-4 / 82mm Mortar

1 Battalion
BHQ T55A
3 companies each 2 T55A

Regimental anti tank company
2 BRDM 2S

Regimental AA company
1 SA-9 AA
1 ZSU 23/4

Recce company
2 OT-65
1 PT-76

Regimental artillery group.
FAO in OT-65
4 122mm M1943 / truck

Divisional artillery would be more 122mm as above, with a battalion of M1943 152mm, and Bm21's
Unfortunately I have not been able to determine how the BMP-1's were issued. Hungary had 500 which is roughly enough for 5 regiments. As there were 5 MR divisions and a tank division, there were obviously not enough to go round. Hungary also possessed 150 BTR-50 which would be enough AFV's for a tank division.

Something a little bit different

I was wondering where to start this project, and thought that an army without a list might be interesting.
(Just as a disclaimer, I've created this from the sources I have available to me. There will be errors, but if anyone cam point them out, could they provide sources to back them up please?)

The Austrian army is rather small given its position bordered by 2 Warsaw Pact states. While Czechoslovakia and Hungary are not great threats, they are still a challenge for a NATO 2 nation.
The country managed to avoid communism after world war 2, but the price paid was no long range artillery, and no missiles of any kind (even Sidewinderers for the fighters until the 1990's).

The following notes are based on Bruce Rea-Taylors book Ultra Modern army lists and organisations volume 1 ( and I have just suppressed a laugh as I wrote this)

The regular forces consisted of a division of 3 equal brigades (I've found some evidence that 1 brigade was short an AT battalion, but I can't substantiate this with the sources available to me).

Austrian Regular Mechanised brigade
Brigade Hq 1 Saurer 4K3 FA FU ICT

1 Tank battalion
BHQ 1 M60A1 or 1 Saurer 4K3 FA FU ICT
3 companies 4 M60A1

1 Infantry battalion
BHQ 1 ICT/Saurer 4K3 FA FU ICT
2 Saurer 4K4 GR1W/81mm Mortar
4 companies 2 Saurer 4K3 G1 ICT
                     1 Saurer 4K4 G2 ICT

1AT battalion
BHQ 1 ICT/Saurer 4K3 FA FU
3 companies 4 SK105

1 artillery battalion 4 M109with FAO

Up to 1 M42 AA attached to any BHQ.

The reserves were organised into 8 brigades (with more independent battalions). I'd possibly use the 3rd world rating for command and control, but still rate them as regular.
as well as these troops, there also appears to have been independent mechanised infantry and AT battalions as listed above. I have no evidence for these beyond that's what the numbers of AFV's suggest that there were present in the army at that time.)

Landwehr Reserve Brigade

Brigade Hq 1 rifle group/truck

3 85mm AT gun/truck
3 35mm AA/truck

3 battalions
BHQ rifle stand /truck
1 81mm mortar/truck
1 120mm mortar/truck
2 106mm RCL/jeep
3 companies 3 rifle stand/truck

1 battalion 4 105mm how/truck with FAO

There were also some fixed border defences which consisted of Centurion turrets, similar to Panther turrets used as part of the Gothic line in Italy in 1944.

No stats card sorry. for the SK 105 I'd use the stats for the AMX13/105. The Saurer APC is the same as any other APC of that era, so probably use the stats for the French AMX-VCI (LAW for AT etc). Use the stats ( and points values) from the AMX-10P for the 20mm armed version. the rest of the bits and pieces should be found on the US data card (or near equivalents)

For creating an army list from this, I'd base the attack list on the mechanised division, and a defend list on the reserve brigades (with 3-4 Centurion turrets thrown in as prepared defenses).

It should provide an entertaining game with its neighboring Warpac nations.

MSH central Europe

One of the major battlegrounds that World War 3 was going to be fought over (on the ground at least) was West Germany. Thus at times it must have resembled a large armed camp, with East Germany not much better.

For the war gamer there is a wide variety of armies to choose from. In Northag, there are the Dutch, Belgians and British, as we ll as the Germans. It was also the destination for the US IIIrd corps with its hardware prepositioned and the men to be flown in from the US. These troops would be facing Russian and east German troops. Further north there is a collection of troops 'defending' Denmark which includes a West German division and the Danish army.

Further south we get into Centag. This at first appears to be only the US and West Germany facing off against the Russians, East Germans and Czechs, buts we also get the French as an added bonus. And that's before we get the West German mountain and airborne troops.

But that's not the whole story. Go a bit further south-east and we come to Austria. Not a member of NATO, but with borders facing the Warsaw pact. So we can add into the Mix Czechoslovakia and Hungary, south of here we have Italy and Yugoslavia. As an added bonus all 5 nations have indigenous arms industries so there are some different AFV's to field.

The last, and possibly most interesting spot is the area shown in the map below.

The border between Greece, Turkey and Bulgaria. maybe not that interesting at first glance, but Greece and Turkey have never really got along. Add in Yugoslavia, Albania and Bulgaria and there are some interesting options here.
To cap it all off, no army in this region has first rate equipment, with some dating back to WW2.

Next will be to have a look at some of the armies in more detail.